[Frameworks] 16mm sound recording

Tue Dec 13 19:13:15 UTC 2016

And in a similar vein, some of the folks from L’Abominable demo’d a pretty nifty system this summer in Nantes that synced with a little light sensor hooked to the front of the lens that just used the strobing of the shutter to generate the sync pulse.  (They were still working out kinks though, like how to account for black film.)

R.

On Dec 13, 2016, at 2:06 PM, Jeff Kreines <jeffkreines at gmail.com<mailto:jeffkreines at gmail.com>> wrote:

On Dec 13, 2016, at 12:49 PM, Francisco Torres <fjtorrespr at gmail.com<mailto:fjtorrespr at gmail.com>> wrote:

which begs the question-  are there are any double sound systems possible today for 16 mm using standard projectors and some digital source?

Richard Tuohy and Carl Looper (in Australia) have developed a clever system that attaches a passive sprocket with encoder to the feed arm of  a projector and syncs it with a digital file playing on a laptop.  Earlier Sam (?), RIP, did something similar using timecode on the optical track and a DTS player, but that was far more expensive.  They are both on FB.

The Sharples book is a good place to start.  But a lot depends on where you are located and which lab you are using (for optical, that is).

Jeff Kreines
Kinetta

2016-12-12 21:31 GMT-04:00 Kenneth Linehan <ken at public-information.org<mailto:ken at public-information.org>>:
Hi Morgan,

If you’re looking to obtain a final screening print ( 16mm  ) with sync sound, the primary format is optical sound track recording. There may be people experimenting with making their own home-brew magnetic tracks, but there’s little to no support for magnetic sound on 16mm these days.

So, if you want to get an optical track made, you definitely can.

There’s a lab in Canada that I’ve used recently to produce an optical negative and they did very good work.

Regarding the overall workflow questions you had, if you use film scanning there are workflows that largely eliminate the need to use mag or a Steenbeck to produce your soundtrack.  Not that I’m opposed to those things :)
This or may not apply to your workflow, but hopefully it will give you some perspective on your options:

Consider the possibility of having your film or negative scanned at 24fps ( progressive ). Although this may add some cost up front, the scan can be useful for many purposes not the least of which is facilitating digital sound workflow. Once your film is scanned at 24fps progressive, maintaining sound sync in the digital environment becomes much easier than with NTSC telecine processes. Note, if you need an NTSC end product, my approach may not totally suit you.

Once you have your scan, import it as a quicktime movie into an audio editing application like ProTools/DigitalPerformer/etc. Create a sync beep and do all your overdub ( voice over ) in the audio app. Make sure the audio editor transport counter is operating at 24fps. Beep must be placed carefully. You can conform subsequent edits of scanned material in your audio editor very easily while still editing on film at the same time. You can conform edits on the fly as you work between film and digital simultaneously if necessary.

You can then mix using your audio workstation and send the mixed audio file ( with sync beep ) to the optical sound lab and they will provide you an optical negative. That optical neg can then be married to the image negative in the final print by your lab. I used dropbox to transfer my mix to the lab in Canada.

There are lots of details and particulars you must be attentive to, but that’s the overview. I’m happy to talk to you about it if you want to send me an email. Other people may have other approaches. You need to find the right mix of techniques for your personal process.

Ken Linehan

On Dec 12, 2016, at 4:02 PM, Morgan Hoyle-Combs <mhoylecombs at yahoo.com<mailto:mhoylecombs at yahoo.com>> wrote:

Hello to all who still film and record to 16mm film (or any celluloid format)

I have an essay/diary that I'm filming with a few old 16mm Cine Kodak cameras. I already have notes and images, but what needs to come next is a voice over. Does anyone who has worked with 16mm sound know how I would go about doing this? I'm more than happy to be corrected, but I have it figured like this: I would record the to a magnetic reel, then I would organize my footage and make a print out of my reels AND in coordination with the dialog. But how would I go about putting the sound stock ONTO the film? I know that I would have to use SINLGE PERF to leave room for the sound tape.

I think this is where I lose myself. Anyone have any ideas on where I should start?

I'm using black and white FYI.

-Morgan
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