[Frameworks] HD cam 24 vs 25? vs DCP?

Fri Dec 13 07:25:24 UTC 2013

 From a presentation perspective, I'd nix both of the rapidly 
obsolescing HDCam and Blu-ray in favour of a ProRes file. Blu-ray is a 
pita for screenings. I've had discs that tested fine one day then 
wouldn't read the next. Even with a BR data drive and the software it's 
a slow and potentially lossy process to rip it back to a file. 

  If you're sending out a physical object (hard-drive/memory stick) 
with files on it, consider including multiple versions with different 
resolutions and/or bitrates. When I have the time to re-encode a file 
I'm pretty careful, but if I have to do so an hour before a screening, 
not so much. 

  You don't mention the running time, but a file that can be 
up//downloaded is theoretically cheaper/faster than shipping a tape or 
disc. At least it pushes the economic and environmental costs of the 
server farms onto the next generation. 

Cheers,

Todd Eacrett
Victoria BC Canada

On Thu, 12 Dec 2013 21:33:07 -0800 (PST), ev petrol  wrote:

       thanks loads folks for all the feedback!!

this is a project that originated on super-8mm (18fps)
I did a 4K scan
then imported into avid as DNxHD 175X MXF
(the highest resolution I could get to play back on my laptop)
did all the conforming (stabilize, resize, timewarp, colour timing)
& exported same as source (avid DNxHD 1920x1080 / 24fps)

I have to make a digibeta & the DVDs (= what the funders asked for)

would it make sense to make a HD ProRes file & a Blu-Ray disc, instead 
of the HD cam, for screening purposes? (sounds like HD cam might not be 
very useful?)

I think the 2K is beyond the capacity of my laptop for the moment, but 
ideally, in the future, I might be able to conform the 4K to the 
current version ... would be lovely to get it onto 35mm at some point

cheers! Moira

moiratierney.net
vimeo.com/moiratierney

     On Thursday, December 12, 2013 9:33 PM, Aaron F. Ross  wrote:

   I want to reiterate that the ProRes codec is lossy. ProRes 4444 is
the best, it's full 4:4:4 color sampling and can optionally preserve
RGB color space if you're working with graphics. But if you're
looking for a truly lossless mastering format, the best option is
still Quicktime Animation at 100% quality. /// Aaron
///////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////

At 12/12/2013, you wrote:
> I agree. HDCam-SR is a preferable tape master (but expensive to read 
> from because only big labs have the players). A ProRes file is 
> definitely more useful to work with, though a physical tape master is 
> reassuring to have. 24PFS is the most compatible framerate for film 
> original and HD projection including DCP. If you then make a 
> downconverted SD version on beta or as an SD file then 25fps is the 
> standard for that version. Watch out for DCP - this is an encoded 
> file package like a DVD and certainly not a master element. It cannot 
> be accessed or copied. It cannot even be read from in real time - it 
> has to be ingested into the server. It is only useful for screenings 
> in cinemas that are equipped. You are right to worry about servers 
> and platforms - some DCPs don't play on all systems. But DCP has 
> become the Hollywood standard to replace release prints. It is handy 
> to have available for potential screenings an HD ProRes file, a 
> Blu-Ray disc, and/or a DCP, an SD file, a beta, a DVD... But for 
> preservation, archiving and future compatibility,the best master now 
> is a 2K file, either in DPX or ProRes 4:4:4 or as tiff images. Down 
> the road you will be able to convert that into anything you will need 
> and you could even make a 35mm negative from it, which is the best 
> solution of course. -Pip At 16:28 -0800 12/12/13, David Tetzlaff 
> wrote: >I'd recommend getting your film transferred to the highest 
> quality >codec available, then converting it to whatever you need on 
> your own >(or a friend's) computer (if you don't have a Mac). > 
> >HD-CAM IS NOT FULL 1080P RESOLUTION! >It's a now technologically 
> obsolete tape format that uses an >anamorphic frame to get within the 
> recording bandwidth of the tape >apparatus. > >You'll want your film 
> outputted to a file on a hard-drive >regardless, not to any form of 
> tape. If the transfer service can't >do that, f**k 'em, and find 
> someone who can. > >Assuming you have access to a Mac, I'd recommend 
> ProRes 4:4:4. Not >that you'd ever send it out in that, but as a 
> 'best-quality' master. >I assume DCP would be better (??) but I don't 
> know of any software >you could use to downconvert it. > >If it's 
> shot at 24fps, get it transferred at 24fps. If you need to >send it 
> out to PAL-land, they might have 24fps capability... And if >they 
> don't, you can do the 24-25 conversion yourself in software. >That 
> way you have the option of doing a 1frame=1frame conversion so >every 
> frame remains intact but it just runs a little faster, or you >can do 
> a transfer that preserves the running time, and uses some >algorithm 
> to blend frames to make up the difference. If you're using >something 
> like Apple Compressor to do that (24-25), there are lots >of 
> different settings you can manipulate to make sure you get the >best 
> possible quality, and it will take days to render as a result. >So 
> again, you'd want to only do this once, and use your 24fps master >to 
> create a 25fps 'master' in the best codec available, from which >you 
> would then create whatever 25fps distribution versions you would 
> >need... >

> _______________________________________________ FrameWorks mailing 
> list FrameWorks at jonasmekasfilms.com 
> https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks

-------------------------------------------

Aaron F. Ross
Digital Arts Guild

_______________________________________________
FrameWorks mailing list
FrameWorks at jonasmekasfilms.com
https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks

-------------------------

_______________________________________________
FrameWorks mailing list
FrameWorks at jonasmekasfilms.com
https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/listinfo/frameworks

-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <https://mailman-mail5.webfaction.com/pipermail/frameworks/attachments/20131212/14e143af/attachment.html>