[Frameworks] Jazz Music and Avant-Garde Film

[Chuck Kleinhans]

Pip,

Thanks for the elaboration; this is very helpful.  There has been a fair amount of progress made in advancing “fair use” of visual materials in mashups, found footage, etc. in the US.

I think because of a somewhat different history, music is a somewhat different case…again, in the US.  Ownership is pretty zealously guarded, it seems.  But I also understand that in the 80s-90s a certain adjustment was made in the recording industry due to the massive use of sampling in hiphop and rap.  I really don’t know the details: just that it was initially very contentious and eventually some system was worked out.

To return to some of the films already mentioned: I can believe that Kenneth Anger said he had the rights to the music in Scorpio Rising.  But I can also believe that he was fibbing.  After all, who’s going to check up on it?  IF he was caught, what could the original owner of the music copyright expect to get from the filmmaker?  Enough to make it worthwhile to pay some lawyer to  pursue it?  And if you won a judgement, what would these artists, or their estates, actually be able to cough up?

Did Bruce Conner clear all the rights to the clips in A Movie?  I’d bet “no”.

Chuck





On Nov 10, 2017, at 6:12 AM, Pip Chodorov <frameworks at RE-VOIR.COM<mailto:frameworks at RE-VOIR.COM>> wrote:

Chuck,

As a "DVD executive" I can tell you that we simply sign contracts with filmmakers in which they indemnify us against any copyright claims.

In some cases we have signed contracts for found footage films in which we invented the clause below (our contract with Martin Arnold is a good example). We have never had a problem.

Re:Voir Video understands that the Films are made from uncleared, recuperated material, images and sounds from previously released feature films. Due to the nature of this work, neither Licensor nor Re:Voir Video can guarantee that their distribution in the form of Home Video Products will not incur claims, liens or encumbrances and both parties agree to share costs to defend this form of work as creative, new and original fair use of cultural media fabric.
-Pip



At 8:52 +0000 10/11/17, Chuck Kleinhans wrote:

Not to question the  expertise of fellow frameworkers about film, but I think we need to hear  from intellectual property lawyers and DVD executives on this matter.

As I understand it, music rights for films are handled by a few Hollywood outfits.  All  about rights by artisans and indies are automatically refused by the copyright owners (or some absurd fee is given suitable for commercial cinema and TV).

So you have to work through the spendy lawyers at these intellectual property shops.  Can a starving artist get a break?  probably a matter of luck or accident or pityŠ.but I really don¹t know.



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